Pro Poker School

PokerStars Game #22563874500: Tournament #123490028, $5.00+$0.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level X (300/600) - 2008/12/02 15:41:31 ET
Table '123490028 408' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: n44bj2 (14237 in chips)
Seat 2: BIG KODAK (7270 in chips)
Seat 3: gerrard1243 (6860 in chips)
Seat 4: Blamke10 (51375 in chips)
Seat 5: pina70 (36245 in chips)
Seat 6: K.O.GR (11781 in chips)
Seat 7: surfoval (19440 in chips)
Seat 8: phreshbec (25995 in chips)
Seat 9: MrMorgan2 (23895 in chips)
n44bj2: posts the ante 50
BIG KODAK: posts the ante 50
gerrard1243: posts the ante 50
Blamke10: posts the ante 50
pina70: posts the ante 50
K.O.GR: posts the ante 50
surfoval: posts the ante 50
phreshbec: posts the ante 50
MrMorgan2: posts the ante 50
phreshbec: posts small blind 300
MrMorgan2: posts big blind 600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to BIG KODAK [Kd Ac]
n44bj2: folds
BIG KODAK: raises 6620 to 7220 and is all-in
gerrard1243: folds
Blamke10: folds
pina70: folds
K.O.GR: folds
surfoval: folds
phreshbec: calls 6920
MrMorgan2: folds
*** FLOP *** [4s 4d Qh]
*** TURN *** [4s 4d Qh] [8c]
*** RIVER *** [4s 4d Qh 8c] [Qs]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
phreshbec: shows [9s 9d] (two pair, Queens and Nines)
BIG KODAK: shows [Kd Ac] (two pair, Queens and Fours)
phreshbec collected 15490 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 15490 | Rake 0
Board [4s 4d Qh 8c Qs]
Seat 1: n44bj2 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: BIG KODAK showed [Kd Ac] and lost with two pair, Queens and Fours
Seat 3: gerrard1243 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: Blamke10 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: pina70 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: K.O.GR folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: surfoval (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: phreshbec (small blind) showed [9s 9d] and won (15490) with two pair, Queens and Nines
Seat 9: MrMorgan2 (big blind) folded before Flop
The bubble was about 70 places away. There was like 4,400 people in this tourney and paid top 630. Even if I limp here I still shove to a raise preflop. Wasnt worried about the money just was hoping to take it down preflop or have a bigger stack call with a weaker ace. If I win the hand it puts me at about the stack average. I guess if I limp and nobody raised I could fold after the flop. I think I played it right. Blinds were getting to big.

Sorry the hand didn't work out for you. We've all been there. If you limp and shove to a raise which he would have almost certainly raised, then you are in the same boat. But, the bottom line is that anyone playing his stack size would almost never fold that hand to your re-raise all in right? So you are making a big play and hoping to get paid off one way or the other against someone who will not fold. I think the key is that its a tournament not a cash game. You have to do everything in your power to not only get chips but to ensure survival as long as possible. Your next hand could've been AA QQ whatever....The hindsight being 20/20 what if scenario is:

You raise 2.5 to 3xBB pre flop. He flat calls. Now you have an idea that he possibly has a real hand and he is wondering about you having AK AQ 10 10 etc.... You represent a Big PP or AQ on the flop by c-betting. He flat calls. You bet again about 1/2 your stack on the turn, now he's wondering if AQ or a 4 is a real possibility. He calls, or possibly folds. If he calls the Q hits on the river and you get it all in, maybe he buys it and lets it go....its a stretch but i've seen it happen that way more than once. It's like that FTP commercial with Gus Hansen...all about how you tell the story. The above is just one possibility presented as a what if....At least going that route you have a chance to push him off the hand post flop. I've been trying this strategy and its been working pretty well for me lately.

Yeah but I have only 7,200 big blind is 900 you get dealt AK not much u can do like I said I didnt care about making just the money. Just one of those hands u think u would probably win. That point in the tourney I'm not limping with AK so pretty much my make or break hand and it turned out to be my break hand. Next post will be success I hope Thanks for the input always good to hear another point of view. I will keep posting on the regular.

I thought about you today because I did pretty much the same thing earlier!! I had less chips and it was a turbo which I think changes things a little bit only because hand ranges are usually a lot wider. I was called by A7 suited and QK. The other A flopped a nut flush and that was it. Looks like Big Slick is taking some big beats lately!
Hope you hit yours next time.

FYI, this post should probably be under the Hand Analysis section of the forum.

I think the play is absolutely fine and have done the same myself numerous times. You won't last much longer without picking up some blinds and AK is as good a starting hand as we can hope for even though OOP.

Having said it is not an auto shove for me (although it used to be). Here we are OOP so I might be inclined to raise if my opponents are tight (if loose I am shoving).

If I am re-raised pre-flop I will shove/call all-in unless two or more players are involved and I have a really good read that one of them has AA or KK.

If I am called...

Even if the flop misses me there is a decent chance the flop missed my opponent too. Now if I shove it is a much tougher call for my opponent for a few thousand chips more. If I pick up the pot uncontested I not only win the blinds but the extra chips my opponent put in too.

Although it would be rare I can get away from the hand post flop (it would have to be really bad for my hand). Of course I won't have many chips left and will have to shove any two within in the next round of betting.

Yeah I should of posted under hand analysis. Just noticed that. Good call. Next time I will.

This is great discussion, way to bring it Big_Kodak.

This is what makes learning poker great, you can limp, raise, or shove here and all plays have some serious pros and cons and being able to quickly analyze that choice in a matter of seconds is partly the essence of the game.

I may do any of the three in this spot, seeing that since I have AK it is very very unlikely the AA or KK is in someone elses hand so you know you are at best dominating your opponents or at worst coinflipping with them. ♦ Sometimes I like to limp, which gets you a cheap flop sometimes and you can now outplay your opponent post flop. If you get raised then you make a read given the player but I would usually reraise allin seeing you need to double up plus you often will find your opponent overplaying a hand you have dominated. ♦ A standard raise will often win you the pot right there, which helps cause you add the blinds and antes to your stack buying you some more time. ♦ Shoving is something I like to do here a lot. If you take it down right away you not only gain the chips but you changed your table image which you can now use to your advantage later. Mostly though I love having the looser playing bigger stacks call you with a hand you have dominated.